LP versus Diku


This is an intermud conversation that pretty much explains my
opinion on the LP v Diku question. To read a related rant, click here.


[2006.06.20-10.21] Darque@Steamworks <dead_souls> There are a few general
questions I have about LPC in general and how DS applies to those notions.

[2006.06.20-10.21] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> hopefully i'll have the
answers

[2006.06.20-10.21] Darque@Steamworks <dead_souls> I had always assumed that LPC
was very talkerish without typical MUD functions, I assume that I wrong in this
regard.

[2006.06.20-10.22] Daelas@Moraelinost <dead_souls> works :)

[2006.06.20-10.22] Darque@Steamworks <dead_souls> Is there a particular reason
that LPC has not been used as often to make typical MUDs as DIKU and it's
children?

<some stuff removed here>

[2006.06.20-10.28] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> ok ya good question

[2006.06.20-10.28] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> the problem is historical

[2006.06.20-10.28] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> diku uses c

[2006.06.20-10.28] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> meaning that pretty much 
anything you code for diku mud A will work on diku mud B

[2006.06.20-10.29] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> i presume there are exceptions, 
but that's generally the case

[2006.06.20-10.29] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> this has created a sort of
"snippet culture" in which there are hundreds, if not thousands, of code pieces
called snippets people can download

[2006.06.20-10.29] <dead_souls> Daelas@Moraelinost nods

[2006.06.20-10.30] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> they can put these together, 
download some pre-fabricated areas, and shazam, they have a mud
people can play on immediately

[2006.06.20-10.30] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> because this is relatively 
easy to do, there are many diku muds, many more than lpc. because with lpc, you 
can't really do that

[2006.06.20-10.30] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> each mud is usually 
customized right from the start, so that code pieces from one dont work 
on another

[2006.06.20-10.31] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> add to this the lack of an 
olc, and lpc's have dwindled over the years

[2006.06.20-10.31] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> because you have to know 
what you're doing, in order to make a mud that people will want to play on

[2006.06.20-10.32] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> dead souls is supposed to 
mitigate that a bit. it has an olc, and an upcomping "compatibility project"
will hopefully cut down on the code incompatibility problems

[2006.06.20-10.32] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> the end

[2006.06.20-10.32] <dead_souls> Karri@Dionea applauds!

[2006.06.20-10.32] <dead_souls> Cratylus@Dead Souls bows.

[2006.06.20-10.32] <dead_souls> Daelas@Moraelinost agrees wholeheartedly.

<some stuff removed here>

[2006.06.20-10.35] Daelas@Moraelinost <dead_souls> I'd be lost trying to futz with C.

[2006.06.20-10.35] <dead_souls> Karri@Dionea nods.

[2006.06.20-10.35] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> with lpc, doing substantial 
modifications requires cubstantial LPC expertise, but it is much easier than C

[2006.06.20-10.36] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> if you happen to be a whiz 
at C, diku might be the right choice

[2006.06.20-10.36] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> there are other advantages 
that come with being a C only mud. evaluation speed chief among them

[2006.06.20-10.37] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> if the mud doesn't have to 
waste time interpreting code, and just runs the binary, you can do things 
much more quickly

[2006.06.20-10.38] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> the theoretical top limit 
of number of simultaneous players, therefore, is higher for diku than lpc on
the same machine

[2006.06.20-10.38] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> as an example

[2006.06.20-10.38] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> but for the most part these 
advantages are not of practical use

[2006.06.20-10.38] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> since most muds do not have 
hundreds of players, and LPC can easily handle 200 or more

[2006.06.20-10.39] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> cf Discworld

[2006.06.20-10.39] <dead_souls> Karri@Dionea thinks C is easier in some ways.  
With LPC, I have to figure out where all the files are and how they interact. 
With a C program, you have a distinct beginning and end.

[2006.06.20-10.40] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> there are definite pluses to 
diku. i dont diss it as a codebase. if i seem to sneer at it, it's at the
snippet kiddies that pretend they "run a mud" when they really just run someone 
elses code

[2006.06.20-10.40] Zeus@Empire of Rome <dead_souls> thats what I'm doing :P

[2006.06.20-10.41] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> not really

[2006.06.20-10.41] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> i mean yes i suppose in a way

[2006.06.20-10.41] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> but i've visited your mud a bit

[2006.06.20-10.41] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> it's clearly your own thing

[2006.06.20-10.41] Zeus@Empire of Rome <dead_souls> your code base though, without 
that I couldn't do jack heh

[2006.06.20-10.41] Zeus@Empire of Rome <dead_souls> for which I am thankful

[2006.06.20-10.41] Zeus@Empire of Rome <dead_souls> QCS rocks heh

[2006.06.20-10.42] Cratylus@Dead Souls <dead_souls> it's just a tool. 
that's my point. dead souls is a tool you can use, which is itself open 
to modification. a lot of dikus are "black boxes" to their owners, who need 
to beg for people who know C to come work for them so they can do things